This is a cleaned up log, of the United
Kingdom UFO Network Saturday 27th Sptember 1997 IRC meeting on
#UFO with guest Matthew Williams. Mathew kindly gave up almost three hours of his spare time
to answer some questions for the regular members of the channel, below
you will find a list of questions that was asked along with his replies.
The name in between the < >'s e.g.
CREDITS:
*** Raine changes topic to "Matthew Williams Moderated meet, plz msg your questions to Raine and NOT the guest speaker"
<truthseek> I have got a cuseeme feed if anyone wants to log on
<truthseek> the IP is 195.99.52.33
<Crow> ok all we will be going into moderated mode shortly channel #ufo2 will be open for unmoderated disscusion
<Crow> http://alpha.mic.dundee.ac.uk/ft/crop_circles/truthseekers/truthmain.html
<truthseek> guess that means we start
<truthseek>I suppose I will start then; hello everyone. Thanks for coming. My names Matthew Williams
<truthseek> I think there is some sort of moderation on so you need to address your questions as a /msg to the moderator
*** John_z sets mode: +m
<Rainey> Hello everyone, I would just like to say thank you to Matthew (truthseek) for coming to the meet to give us some information and answer your questions, the meet will be moderated, could you please /msg me with your questions and not Matt, thank you. Matt could you please give evryone an introduction
<truthseek> he will pass them to me I believe and I will then reply in public - am I right? Mr Crow?
<Crow> yes we will pass them to the channel matthew
<truthseek> I am based in the UK, Wales to be precise. I started in UFOs in 1990 after I had a sighting of a major unexplained paranormal event - 1 200ft yellow triangle sitting on the side of a mountain...
<truthseek> I am very sympathetic to peoples cliams but not gullible. I now predominantly research UFO and government cover up stories. I have seen ghosts and had out of the body experiences and I used to "work for the government" - hoho.
<truthseek> Ask me about that one if you dare! I have been looking into an underground base in Wilsthire called Rudloe Manor which used to investigate UFOs for the Ministry Of Defence.
<truthseek> This was long denied but myself and a few other researchers got files which proved it, then the fun started when the Govt. nicked the files. We got them back after using an MP to raise a question about the affair in the Houses Of Parliament. We also showed that the same MP was lied to!!!
<truthseek> Lied to by the MOD. He is not happy and the story goes on.
<truthseek> Currently I am sitting here in my room with a camera pointed at me. If anyone wants to see me
<truthseek> I am on CUSEEME under IP number r 195.99.52.33
<truthseek> also I have loads of files and pictures for you to download on ftp://members.aol.com/alienep/irc/
<truthseek> or you can ask me nicely if you can use my anon ftp server which is online now - try the FTP on AOL first though as it will be quicker for you.
<truthseek> I have contributed to TV, Radio and video productions on both sides of the camera. I have a regular feature on LiveTvs "THE WHY FILES"
<truthseek> I am totally commited to UFO truth and don't like charlatans and I expose facts about the subject which some dont want to hear - I have got a name for myself as a bit of a troublemaker,
<truthseek> both in MOD circles and and in UFOLOGY. I don't lie down...
<truthseek> I have researched the abduction phenomenon and worked with regressionists.
<truthseek> Fire away....??
<Crow> ok you ready for the first question matthew, also when you have answered could you please signal us with ?? at the end of your reply.
<Miki> If there is something sinister going on, will not his interest force it to go underground again?
<truthseek> Perhaps but we have to try and root out all secrets.
<truthseek> I dont believe that the GOVT have a right to withold these things from us. Yes I see your point and it is quite likely that all UFO functions at Rudloe Manor have ceased since our interest. We are not totally sure about this though so perhaps they are still there. I keep the best till last and there are some things I am researching RE secret bases that I haven't told people yet.
<truthseek> This will shake the tree. Thanks for this. ??
<hackit> ask him if he knows anything about secret research bases in norfolk!
<truthseek> Well the whole of the East Coast is riddled with underground facilities. I suppose you know this already,
<truthseek> I did a feature on this will is available for doanload on the sites called bunkerbusters.txt
<truthseek> this covers a few east coast bases - I know that they are very secret. Some of the facilities are used for RAF operations. I do not know which may have secret experiments.
<truthseek> Going on but I do know that there are many which are connected to the NADGE radar system, which reaches
<truthseek> into Europe and therefore gives a wide UFO scope for those who are watching...
<truthseek> I hope this answers the question... Ask me a specific area if you wish. ??
<BonzaiBon> First question is what is the most well-known underground base that you are aware of and where specifically is it located at? What is this base's prime objective and how did you come across this information?
<truthseek> RAF Rudloe Manor is the biggest and best I know of. It has 35 Miles of underground interconnecting tunnels
<truthseek> it will be used as a bunker for the royal family. It has a nuclear generator. It has hospitals, pubs and recreation facilities based underground.
<truthseek> It also was the centre for UFO invetsigations in the 1960s and collected ufo reports up until 1992.
<truthseek> We suspect the may still be doing something with UFO reports there today but short of breaking in we are not totally sure.
<truthseek> We have heard rumours of work continuing and this seems reasonable. I hope we find out more soon. ??
<Ufochaser> Do you know about the Deep Underground Military Bases in the US?
<truthseek> Yes, I went to Area51 before they shut the border. This was in 1993, so I was kind of an early bird on that one ;-)
<truthseek> Also I know about many facilities in California such as edwards and the
<truthseek> Antelope Valley one with the retractable radar cross sction thing...
<truthseek> The whole point is with underground stuff is it is essential for military to use bunkers because nuclear explosions kill troops - as you guessed ;-)
<truthseek> So they have to build extensive facilities. They just don't like to admit to it.
<truthseek> Some are in use, some are closed - some get transferred to other projects. These ones sometimes go under-cover and could be home to black projects.
<truthseek> It is exactly the same here in the UK. The bases get sold from the MOD to public companies which are nothing more than fronts for the MOD.
<truthseek> These bases have underground tunnels beneath them, and they are in use.
<truthseek> We caught the MOD doing this at a place called Monks Park and we penetrated the base to see what was down there. It was immense! I do not use the word lightly. ??
<{ChuD}> "Do you feel that perhaps the government are covering up all ufo information for a good reason and its for our own benefit to now know?"
<truthseek> No it can never be for a good reason. This is how I see secrecy.
<truthseek> If you have a secret and you don't want people to know for a good reason... when people get close to the truth
<truthseek> or stumble on the truth you have to shut them up. This means people get treated badly. I think that some people have been
<truthseek> persecuted for their research efforts. This can never be acceptable.
<truthseek> When it comes to the the security codes for nuclear missiles - yes keep it secret.
<truthseek> When it comes to UFOs, we have a right to know so tell us the truth, no matter how much it may frighten us.
<truthseek> I suspect the real reason they don't tell is because it is not us who will be frighetened but it is they who are frightened of us knowing the truth and empowering ourselves.
<truthseek> So I can never agree with secrets of this type.
<truthseek> Thanks for that ??
<bambina> Matt, I am the Assistant National Director for SUFOIT/PARA-4(scient ific UFO investigative team/Paranormal Activity Research Associtation. I and my members are looking into the underground facility at Raven Rock, PA, USA, and the Lake Ontario Bases. Do you have any infomation on these?
<truthseek> PS IP 195.99.52.33 is my CUseeME camera ;-)
<truthseek> Wow thats am impressive title ;-)
<John_z> download cuseeme at http://www.cuseeme.com (9MB)
<truthseek> No I have never heard of those - I am not a total USA bunker expert. I know a few of the main ones and a few speculated ones such as Dulce but I am not a great expert. I would love to see what you have to say on it though if you want to email me something.
<truthseek> To anyone who wants to email me its: truthseekers@celtic.co.uk
<truthseek> I publish a magazine and ezine called Truthseekers Review, I can put your articles in if you submit them ;-)
<truthseek> ??
<Crow> Do you think Nick Pope really knows about Rudloe manor, and is for unknown reasons denying any knowlege of it and if so why do you think has says he has never heard of the place before?
<truthseek> He used to say he didn't know about it. He was being coy. He was then forced by us to admit that he knew about it
<truthseek> but he then said that he was SURE it didnt do anything important to do with UFOs.
<truthseek> Well thats a big turn from "I dont know", to, "It does nothing", which makes me a little suspicious
<truthseek> We cuaght him out on this and at the same time got Govt docs proving it was involved in UFO research
<truthseek> in the 1960s thru 92
<truthseek> and we showed him this proof and he just scoffed and said that he never had any reports from them
<truthseek> ... interesting considering they were dubbed by the MOD as the "central co-ordination point for UFO reports"
<truthseek> their rank and title and job descriptions put them many levels above Pope so we put it to him that perhaps he was not the main arm of the MOD
<truthseek> for UFO investigations and that they were the main people. He did not want to accept this.
<truthseek> He said whilst he was at the MOD he knew of no other departments that dealt with UFOs other than those under him.
<truthseek> Well these people at Rudloe and a few other places were above him and weren't telling him what they were doing.
<truthseek> They even were supposed to send their fuinal reports to him for guess what - filing.
<truthseek> He says that there was nobody looking at his case files whilst he went home from work - we contend that they never needed to because they had better ones than he did and he was only fed the dross reports to keep him happy.
<truthseek> This is the way the cards seemed to have stacked against him.
<truthseek> It does not put him in a good light. ??
<Crow> thanks matt
<stu7> ...Matthew...everyone is talking about the "traingular" ufos...have you researched those at all ?
<truthseek> Yes and no. I saw a triangular light myself which sparked my interest as you heard earlier
<truthseek> but I have not had many reports of those myself. I know some people who specialise in that sort of area. I know that they are being seen all over the country.
<truthseek> I would also offer that because of the triangle hype that exists today a lot of people are misidentifying aircraft as triangular UFOs
<truthseek> I have infact seen, and digitally analyised some UFO footage which were cliamed triangle. ufos. They were aircraft.
<truthseek> Omar Fowler is the UK expert on this subject email me and I will forward you his details. He even
<truthseek> publishes a magazine on the triangles.
<truthseek> Hang on a minute, guess what I nearly forgot I saw a completely unknown form of aircraft in Yeovilton coming out
<truthseek> of the RNAD Yeovilton base. I didn't see this bit, but it aparently went nearly straight up.
<truthseek> I saw the shape and drew it and gave it to aircraft enthusiasts and they could not identify it. This was in the early part of this year. ??
<hackit> ask him how he penetrated monks park and did he relise it was used for certain purposes.
<truthseek> Well the report will appear in the next UK edition of Alien Encounters magazine in full. It reads like a boys own tale with
<truthseek> me and Richard Conway sneaking in past guards and going down a tunnel entrance
<truthseek> we set off alarms going in but ran, ran, ran along corridors and hid down the 1000th alleyway. I think because they get a few false alarms
<truthseek> they thought we weren't in the tunnels so didn't search for us. We were lucky.
<truthseek> When we tried to get out we neard automatic rifle fire as well as shotguns. This showed that the nearby MOD base had their guards come over to help out
<truthseek> with security - so much for this civilians owned base eh?
<truthseek> We had to get out via a back door and set off other alarms. They were firing at us as we ran. I don't know if those shots were in the air or at us.
<truthseek> Thankfully we got away with good photos a good story and our lives.
<truthseek> As for what was the base used for. Well I guessed it was used for something connected with Rudloe Manor because they interconnect via underground tunnels - this we know.
<truthseek> There were storage bays with hi-tech gear in them. We saw satellite transmission stuff and weapons parts.
<truthseek> We also saw a bay marked CIA - but this could mean something else to the MOD, I dont know.
<truthseek> We only looked in a few boxes.
<truthseek> Hope this answers the question. ??
<Crow> sure does matt
<Hideout> Do you think that there could well be ordinary civilians working in these bases or are they so top secret that they wouldnt let this happen?
<truthseek> Well this base is storage by the looks of it. That is why it was able to be sold off. I think the really secret stuff they still hold on to as RAF bases.
<truthseek> I know that there is a secret base which is totally covert near Rudloe Manor called the CCC
<truthseek> and this is completely UNMARKED.
<truthseek> This is very high security and we penetrated that one too - I did this for a sighting TV show and we got quite far in.
<truthseek> It is going to be on sightings soon. The guys filming it said they had never had so much excitement!
<truthseek> I love taking TV crews into dangerous situations hehehe;-)
<truthseek> We got taken out by the guards who foolishly opened one of the security doors by mistake. They must have thought we were service personnel when they saw us on the CCTV. When we got inside they realised their error and came and got us.
<truthseek> One of the guards locked himself inside a security compartment in his rush to get us he typed in the wrong code on a keypad. We filmed all of this.
<truthseek> Keep an eye out for it. Rudloe Manor featured for the first time in the US. I can't help but feel a bit proud ;-)
<truthseek> Thanks ??
<Vad> truthseek: do you know how the radar tracking facilities at rudloe compare in comparisson to other large gov. bases in the world, and do you have any idea of just how much unusual ufo activity is logged day to day? <truthseek> Good question
<truthseek> Well heres the good answer. Rudloe has what it terms as lodger units on its base facilities.
<truthseek> These lodger units function seperately from RUDLOE itself but are housed there.
<truthseek> One such lodger unit is the CDCN which stands for the Command Of the Defence Communications Network.
<truthseek> Sound important.... well it should. Its the MAIN HUB of all British military data, voice and radar signals
<truthseek> They have uplinks off the Rudloe Site at a place called Colerne Airbase (which is the best, most functional disused airbase I have ever seen!!! - check your ordanance survey maps to see it called a disused airbase!)
<truthseek> The uplinks are to the SKYNET sattelite systems which allow vocie and data comms for the Mil.
<truthseek> One othe rthigs they do at Rudloe is to monitor the Radar screens of all UK radar stations. This allows them to plot and plan wars because in another part of Rudloe there is a backup war command centre.
<truthseek> These stations, if they send any data comms or voice comms about any matter CDCN can pick it up.
<truthseek> If they see UFOs on Radar then CDCN and others are almost sitting in the background watching too.
<truthseek> This means that they could be watching for UFOs full time. I know some stuff about that and will hint at this time that is exactly what is happening but I can't go into further details until some things are checked.
<truthseek> Thanks ??
<JeroenW> Question: Have you heard of Alien delegations being located in Underground bases... either by themselves (As in alien civilizations created some Underground bases) or as ambassadorshoused in bases made by co-operation between aliens and humans. It is said that the centrum for this is located in Alberqurqe (spelled the name wrong).
<truthseek> I know the place but I ant spell it either ;-)
<truthseek> I didn't know about that but it is interesting. I hear it all the time but it is always from distant sources. Some of the closest sources I have got to on rumours such as this are unreliable to say the least. This is a shame.
<truthseek> I have also got some people saying the same things to me about the UK having such bases. One rumour surrounded a base on Ilkley Moor in the UK
<truthseek> which is supposedly connected to Menwith Hill NSA facility
<truthseek> yes folks MENWITH HILL NSA listening station in the UK - so secret they won't talk about it in parliament!
<truthseek> ho hum
<truthseek> BTW everyone I am listening to the soundtrack of Stargate the movie - good mood music. ??
<Crow> heh
<bambina> Matt, it is said that the triangle UFO's are a US and UK invention, with a little help from alien influence. What do you think?
<truthseek> quite possible. I hear pro and con to that.
<truthseek> I hear that we have the technology to do this and have done so at places such as RAF Wharton in the UK.
<truthseek> It is a dvelopment base for British Aerospace.
<truthseek> Then I hear the stories about the triangles and abductions - which doesn't neatly fit the pattern of MOD activity...
<truthseek> and some of those possible alien triangles are much bigger than any fighters - and to be so big and silent....
<truthseek> if they have this technology then we are being lied to by our GOVTS big time. If it were true I would be fighting my way into those bases to expose it...
<truthseek> in reality though I suspect we have small scale RPV triangles and thats about it.??
<SUFOIT\PA> How deep do you think is the USA's involvement in UFO sightings in the UK? Worldwide?
<truthseek> Well one or two unreliable sources place involvement as very high. I can't see it myself. I think the US if they have secret technology would fly it out of the UK.
<truthseek> Thats for sure.
<truthseek> If they were to try and develop technology with us here in the UK then we would have access to those secrets too and could develop these things into our aircraft.
<truthseek> If we are in on a much darker secret level with the US and involved in the abduction stuff - then I would be worried but I see little evidence of this coming from my abductee witnesses.
<truthseek> I think we are probably looking at joint co-op on research and investigation and perhaps coverup on the subject.
<truthseek> I nor nobody I know and respect can say if this is good or bad.
<truthseek> I have got a case at the moment which implicates the US in flying crashed UFO techno with the UK
<truthseek> This is my first case of this type. I have not got a clue which way it will go - will it get proven or will it not be able to be proven or will the witness turn out to be unreliable. I just dont know. I hope for the truth whatever. Thanks ??
<watch^dog> Indiana State Director for SUFOIT/PARA-4 here, How do you handle a situation when you catch someone in a lie, or deception, or when presented with undeniable information, brushes it off as hogwash?
<truthseek> Well sometimes I walk away and let other people deal with it or sometimes I take the bull by the horns and sort it out myself.
<truthseek> It depends on my mood.
<truthseek> If you knew what has been happening to me lately with **** from certain UFO research orgnanisations and persons you would be shocked...
<truthseek> things are not good at the top of British Ufology. There is much absue of witnesses and people
<truthseek> not taking ethical points seriously in UFO research. I have just dealt with a serious matter in one organisation I belonged to. Because of my
<truthseek> mistrust for their operating policies after I did what I had to do, I resigned. I could not associate with them after this.
<truthseek> Thanfully the situation I came to them with was resolved and the guilty parties are out to. I just thought the whole way it was dealt with left a lot to be desired.
<truthseek> I have had some bad ufologists threaten me with physical violence. In this instance I called the police because I feared not the person but that I was being set up.
<truthseek> I had serious reason to believe this.
<truthseek> So I suggest that however you deal with these problems you do it openly and honestly and with the full co-operation of others because when you take up the challenge to clean up some things that certain people
<truthseek> dont want cleaned up, you face trouble and will need support.
<truthseek> Hope that answers you? Just don't lie down, just choose your moments to take action. ??
<Mulder> What other countries could be involved in this? Is it possible that the United States and Britain are the only countries involved? Or is it on a more global scale?
<truthseek> I would say Global
<truthseek> A pseudo secret deal was done with France and the UK over sharing "all" intelligence info
<truthseek> we have a similar agreement with the US.
<truthseek> This means that france is in on the act
<truthseek> Off the point here but it was because of this secret agreement with france and the UK that the UK Govt backed the French nuclear tests a few years ago.
<truthseek> They did not want to break off deals etc by not backing the tests.
<truthseek> The deals involve Nuclear arms secerts having been shared between UK France and US. So there was a real reason for UK and US to let those tests go ahead. Not many people know that!!!!
<truthseek> I would imagine that Mossad and other high level intel orgs are involved. Even KGB probably has an angle on this. I am not sure about the truth behind the conspiracy theory that the Russians were helping the US with
<truthseek> the UFO problem and this is why they relaxed and opened the borders... interesting thought though.
<truthseek> I cant help but think of Reagan and his "UFO speech". I think he knew more and I think he was giving us all a very big hint! Thanks ??
<bambina> Matt, I've talked to "contactees" (don't like the term abductees) who have said that they have been in these underground facilities. They also mention seeing MEN in lab coats, and one mentioned MJ-12. This speculates that our govt's are taking contactees also. Any thoughts?
<truthseek> Well if the abductee scenario is true in regards GOVT and abductions then contactees would be taken too sure.
<truthseek> I think this goes without saying....
<truthseek> The only trouble I have is knowing what is the truth. We must tread carefully with the use of hypnosis.
<truthseek> It is a useful tool but I did a session once where the abductee recalled events with GOVT people and it seemed like he was talking about a USA scenario
<truthseek> when we heard all he had to say it sounded exactly like a scene from the movie Roswell. We discounted this info
<truthseek> I think we must be even more careful in the western world because like it or not we are all saturated by UFO TV and media and it does sink in
<truthseek> I do not discount what these people say totally it is just that so many times the fantasy that is created rings of TV or books.
<truthseek> It does in the cases I have dealt with.
<truthseek> What I need now is proof. I want to have the names off lab coats and the vehicle registrations
<truthseek> which "should" be there if the abduction is not a fantasy.
<truthseek> When you start to delve in those areas the abductee rebels. This is when *I* think they are trying to maintain the fantasy.
<truthseek> We then try and get the person back on a sensible track and start again.
<truthseek> Trained hypnotsist can tell when this is happening anyhow. It is an interesting facet of hypnosis.
<truthseek> I just hope that everything that people say under hypnoisis is not taken as gospel by those listening. We must be careful. Thanks ??
<BonzaiBon> What exactly, in full description, is your belief that is going on in these underground bases? If you believe that there are vehicles being stored there of extraterrestrial origin, do you believe that we are enveloping that technology ourselves? For what reasons would we use that technology?
<truthseek> for those who havent tried yet my cuseeme is running on IP 195.99.52.33
<truthseek> for those who havent tried yet!!!
<truthseek> this is a webiste I maintain
<truthseek> http://members.aol.com/alienep/index.htm
<truthseek> also visit our ftp site at ftp://members.aol.com/alienep/irc/
<truthseek> where there are loads of piccys and text files from my hard drive
<truthseek> Well at Rudloe Manor I only think that they investigate the UFO sightings. I don't have any info to speak of UFOs stored or alien bodies,
<truthseek> unless you take on board a Remote Viewer who I asked to go there (he didn't know me) and he got the tunnels bit spot on... he did say there were aliens there.
<truthseek> This is problematic as I have never spoken to anyone who has worked there who can back this up.
<truthseek> I am not sure that there are underground alien bases. I hold final judgement. I find it an interesting and compelling idea but I just haven't been able to prove it.
<truthseek> I cannot accept the anecdotal evidence which I am given - by unreliable sources and by abductees.
<truthseek> I only go with information which can be backed up in other ways - which is why 99% of what I am told in regression sessions I cannot really use to PROVE to the world what is taking place.
<truthseek> I bear these things in mind but they aren't part of my reality at the moment.
<truthseek> If you want my speculation on what is going on based on the rumours I have heard they go something like this:
<truthseek> Aliens engineering peoples souls via metaphysical and electronic equipment.
<truthseek> Aliens and MOD studying cloning and soul transferance
<truthseek> Aliens giving GOVT cloning technology so Govt can create hybrid race and drone workers.
<truthseek> Govt doing secret experiments on some captured aliens....
<truthseek> the usual.
<truthseek> I can't verify these things.
<truthseek> Sorry I couldnt be more helpful on that one. ??
<hackit> ask him if hes been approached by "anyone" telling him to back off!!!!!!
<truthseek> Only spammy researchers who are far too paranoid for their own good and by people not involved in the subject who think that the MOD work I do will get me into trouble (gentle warnings)
<truthseek> No I have never had ANY trouble at all. Infact I welcome it. I want to meet trouble head on - face to face, hence why I go into secret MOD establishments and face off the people there.
<truthseek> I think people are very paranoid and double guess what "will happen to you" when they have no direct experience of these threats themselves.
<truthseek> I have spoken to such "terrifieds" and they try very hard to give you the frighteners.
<truthseek> I think these people are far worse than those non-existent govt people they accuse.
<truthseek> Infact they probably do the job for them... hehe ;-)
<truthseek> I think there are people who do get hassled but the ways this happens are far more subtle.
<truthseek> I think that a lot of the UFO researchers are the one we should be careful of. I am very suspicious of a number of researchers.
<truthseek> If anyone is expecting a call from the MIBs it won't happen. What will happen is you will get a researcher turn up at your house, con you out of your master camcorder tapes and photos along with the negs and run
<truthseek> this has the effect of hacking people up and making them upset. Then the fighting starts and this keeps people tied up.
<truthseek> I swear this is the game plan, diversion from the goals and to make people despondent with UFO researchers because of bad behaviour.
<truthseek> Some UFO groups and people cannot behave and I think they are far worse enemies of the subject than the GOVT - but then my question is
<truthseek> are the govt behind those Groups and individuals antics....
<truthseek> Time and time again we see infiltratuion by GOVT of UFO orgs. NICAP was a good example
<truthseek> a few of our beloved british groups behave in a manner which beggars belief. Case files go missing and never see the light of day and real research is supressed AT ALL COSTS.
<truthseek> This is what I have been up against.
<truthseek> Theres the conspiracy if you ask me - they are inside your groups.... ! ??
<John_z> Some people say that abductees could be suffering some kind of mental ilness, they also say that as it runs in families it is probably hereditory what do you think about this?
<truthseek> I am asked all the time do I believe the abductees. I have to say yes.
<truthseek> The consistency of what is said by them is sometimes uncanny. Only small points but those things that you as a dedicated researcher can pick up on.
<truthseek> It takes a lot of absorbtion of cases to be able to look at all the info.
<truthseek> Yes in my opinion they are telling "a" truth.
<truthseek> I don't think it is the only truth. I think that their stories run deeper than they are aware of. You sometimes scratch the surface of these things.
<truthseek> What I feel - from some personal experiences which would take longer than I have to talk about (perhaps - coax me), I believe that the alien scenario is a screen memory.
<truthseek> I think the experience is far more profound than just medical experiments - but this is the only way it can be understood by people when in a physical state.
<truthseek> My own belief of the parts of abductions which we understand is that the aliens are not exactly physical.
<truthseek> I think that the aliens are metaphysical and come from what I can only term as spiritual realms.
<truthseek> I think the realities they exist in cannot be fully undertood by us in normal concept and this is why the abductees are often confused at the deeper levels.
<truthseek> The surface abduction stories remain the same but the deeper stuff just goes awol.
<truthseek> I think we are looking at a spiritual interface and I do not believe that there is anything negative about it.
<truthseek> I honestly believe that all"abductions" are positive no matter what the person feels. I have yet to come across a case wher there has not been some positive influence in peoples lives.
<truthseek> I am troubled by the Budd Hopkins stuff and David Jacobs because I have never met any "abductees" with scare stories like that.
<truthseek> Even the abductees who were scared *during* their experiences have come away with far greater understandings of their own situations
<truthseek> and life in general. I think it gives them perspecives.
<truthseek> Many I know have gone so far towards the aliens that they want to be with them and want to leave this life behind. This is another reason I feel the aliens leave those frightening memories with us
<truthseek> I feel they are trying to persuade us to root ourselves here. We are not all quite ready for what they have to tell us.
<truthseek> I have no personal experience of this myself - I am not an abductee. This is the feeling I get from hearing those people who are abductees. Profound eh....
<truthseek> And I must say that before 1990 Iwas a total skeptic. Since my first UFO sighting the subject has brought me to a faith in "something" or someone else out there which is above us.
<truthseek> I am not saying I am worshipping aliens, simply that I now am open to much more and the experiences I have had have enabled me to enjoy my life to a much fuller degree than I think I would have had not seeing the things I have seen.
<truthseek> So in that way I feel a little like the abductees - enriched by something.
<truthseek> So you got your 1 pennys worth. hehe. I bet I was really ambigiuous on some of that.... ;-) thanks ??
<{ChuD}> " DO u think any country might blow the "cover" on ufo's, what would be the uk/USA reaction to a country that did?"
<truthseek> I think some countries have tried - Mexico, Belgium, Japan
<truthseek> The trouble with this subject is that unless it actually touches somebody in some way people cannot believe in it fully.
<truthseek> Take me for a classic example - pre 1990 I didn't believe in anything
<truthseek> I joked about peoples UFO sightings. I would have watched the TV progs and then scratched my head a little and thought ah well I will believe it when I see it.
<truthseek> Now to a certain degree people WILL believe what they are told by others. It is when the groundswell is high enough
<truthseek> that then BELIEF will change and everyone will believe.
<truthseek> It takes people to be brought to belief slowly. It will not happen overnight unless the subject touches people in some way.
<truthseek> So to answer your question
<truthseek> Some countires have been touched and they are nearer than other countries but it doesn't help if your speaking to people who are not touched.
<truthseek> Also there is without a shadow of a doubt heavy press censorship in the UK and US on these subjects
<truthseek> take Arizona for instance - they could not stop people seeing the UFOs
<truthseek> but they could affect the way it was reported and investigated.
<truthseek> The mayor seemed to be either told to shut up or he wanted to close the story down himself.
<truthseek> That was a coverup
<truthseek> Take MEXICO as another example - that story made total mexico news coverage, and went all around the wire and news services of the world. It was not touched by ANY US or UK tabloids or TV.
<truthseek> That was afterall WORLD news. Sightings commented on the lack of coverage.
<truthseek> So in a way if Independence Day was taking place for real in some lonely part of the world or even in the next state, or county some GOVT people and Press people would still not be telling us.
<truthseek> This is why UFOlogy needs to be grass roots, so we can bypass the normal channels of communication in order to feed the info
<truthseek> and when we all have it then we just lobby TV and press to take these stories seriously
<truthseek> Grass roots is the way forward. ??
<BonzaiBon> why did they not take his film away from him upon seeing him filming?
<truthseek> Who are we talking about ?
<Crow> that was a while back
<Hideout> bonzaibon: you can now speak in the channel
<Crow> shall we come back to BonzaiBon
<truthseek> okies
<truthseek> I think Bonzai may be referring to the cameraman from Sightings. Thats a complicated issue
<truthseek> remember the base I told you about was covert. That is where their problems lie.
<truthseek> In the UK if bases are covert they need special exemption rules in order to take your tape because a covert base is not a military base be definition.
<truthseek> For this reason they do not tell you you cannot film and take photographs so if you do then they can not take them from you.
<truthseek> I have gone into detail on this point with the MOD police here in the UK. We were totally covered for us not being arrested or having our tapes taken.
<truthseek> What we did though was risky because you never can tell if they will just try to take the tape by brute force and lie about it. And they do have weapons down there, but not on show.
<truthseek> So its a stale mate really. If they had tried to take the tape I would have started a fight and asked for the real police to be called in and got them to tape possesion of the tape. I can be devious you see.
<JeroenW> Question: I can still hear Steven Greer (on Art Bell) talk about aliens. He told Art that US Prez. Truman won the election campagne because of his promise to reveal the UFO coverup. After he won presidentship no-one heard about it anymore until on a press conference a reporter asked him about his promise.... Greer told that the tears sprung into Truman's eyes.... What could scare a president so much?
<truthseek> On the next question:Well I dont know about Greers story...
<truthseek> It sounds a bit far fetched but not impossible. We heard the same rumours about Kennedy and others.
<truthseek> Reagan was the most open and he wasn't respected for what he said.
<truthseek> Carter said he saw a UFO sighting and he was quoted as wanting to find out more - it never happened.
<truthseek> Churchill here in the UK asked for info on UFOs and was just told by the MOD that it was nothing of real concern when behind the scenes they were doing many investigations.
<truthseek> This makes me wonder if the public office letters of the GOVT actually hide the fact that perhaps Churchill was told more. We can never find out now, unless somebody spills the beans.
<truthseek> And then we will all try and run down the credibility of the source. Catch 22.
<truthseek> There is a very good saying - who do you believe a lie from ,a king or a beggar.
<truthseek> I think that lies when given by high ranking sources are listened to and this is why most public believe there is no cover up on UFOs.
<truthseek> Leaders are not put into office to expand peoples minds - they are there to govern and just think if you get into office
<truthseek> and you are told "Yeah we know about aliens and UFOs but if you tell anyone about it you won't make it past this term in office because we will smear you"
<truthseek> What would you do?
<truthseek> I think presidents are the puppets of bigger leaders. Those leaders are the unknowns - the secret societies leaders.
<truthseek> America and the UK is run by them. Little is known about their activities.
<truthseek> If we want answers about the aliens we should ask the 66th degree arch Satanist freemasons who probably have lunch with the aliens every day ;-))))))
<truthseek> perhaps....there may be some truth in this. ??
<SUFOIT\PA> Hi Barry here, I am the International Director for SUFOIT/PARA-4, I am a little uncertain of the "ethics" of certain UFO groups and investigators, yet we must work together to seek the truth, how do you handle these situations?
<truthseek> Name dropping again ;-) hehe. Youll be on sighting show yet! ;-))))))
<truthseek> Its just a complex game of life. You have to duck and weave and try and keep people on your side.
<truthseek> Always be open and give away evey piece of information you can (without breaking witness confidentiality)
<truthseek> and by this you set an example.
<truthseek> If you then try and show that behaving in an open manner gets you credit and recognition then people want to behave in the same manner.
<truthseek> It is almost like training a dog to do something and then rewarding it.
<truthseek> God I sound patronising don't I.
<Crow> hehe
<truthseek> I just reward excellence and then this allows people to expand.
<truthseek> Those who hide and shy away or start to attack you I try to work with where I can.
<truthseek> Some of these people who attack do not want to listen and if they cannot be dealt with then I earmark those people as troublemakers
<truthseek> I dont cut them off but I deal with them very carefully.
<truthseek> I think the key is to keep things positive where you can - chastise bad behaviour but reward excellence.
<truthseek> It makes the bad boys feel left out in the cold.
<truthseek> At the moment though I think we are surrounded by bad boys everywhere and they feel in good company
<truthseek> and this is why it is important to set higher standards than theirs -and things will change slowly.
<truthseek> Or they will look stupid... ;-)
<truthseek> I would like ot thank you all for being so patient and listening to this. It is very kind of you.
<truthseek> I realise that IRC is not the easiest medium to hear a speech on... ;-)
<Crow> its been great Matthew we have really enjoyed it.
<John_z> it's been most informative and enjoyable
<Rainey> I would just like to say to Matt on behalf of all the channel thank you very much for sparing some of your valuable time to answer our questions, please feel free to join us anytime, as I'm sure we would all be pleased to see you again.
<truthseek> I would like to thank also the people who asked me on here Vadir and Raine and Crow who have been helping me,
<Hideout> whats matts email addy again?
<truthseek> If anyone wants to CuseeMe I am still xmitting on IP 195.99.52.33
<truthseek> also my FTP page is ftp://members.aol.com/alienep/irc/
<Vadir> truthseek, 2night has been a blast :)
<truthseek> to go and get those articles on some of the things we have been dealing with tonight
<truthseek> along with photos.
<truthseek> my email is truthseekers@celtic.co.uk
<Dave_UFO> Thanks Matthew - a riviting evening.
<hackit> thanks matthew its good to see someone not afraid to speak the truth for a change
<truthseek> my pleasure. I suggest that insteading of me droning on we open it up and i will just jump in deep end styley and do an normal IRC fest.... what say ye?
*** Rainey sets mode: -m
Then follows a free for all as #ufo goes crazy.
